The Words of the Kamiyama Family

Conference with [Black] Heung Jin Nim

Takeru Kamiyama
Compiled from his testimony at the World Mission Center on November 21, 1987, and his speech at Belvedere on December 6, 1987
Translator: Hiroshi Matsuzaki

Rev. and Mrs. Kamiyama offer a full bow to [Black] Heung Jin Nim.

I would like to talk about my experience meeting [Black] Heung Jin Nim [Cleophas / Cleopas Kundioni] for the first time. Actually, it is a story of my faithlessness, and how I changed and finally came to understand what [Black] Heung Jin Nim is bringing to us.

Before he came to New York in November 1987, I had heard many stories about his new existence in the body of a black African young man, traveling around and hearing confessions. I wondered, how can this brother really be [Black] Heung Jin Nim? Members all over the world are claiming that [Black] Heung Jin Nim has spoken through them, but how can we know if he really did?

My Skeptical Mind

It was with this extremely skeptical mind that I went to East Garden, where [Black] Heung Jin Nim was to greet True Parents for the first time since he had been embodied. Some of the leaders gathered in the kitchen beforehand to talk. We had all heard rumors and felt this brother might be an imposter with evil intentions, so we made a determination to protect Father at any cost. Even Hyo Jin Nim was fully prepared to do anything necessary to defend Father. Such a "welcoming" atmosphere we created for his arrival!

Then [Black] Heung Jin Nim and his party arrived. Father and Mother were waiting in the reception room. [Black] Heung Jin Nim ran over to Father and practically jumped into his arms, saying, "Father! Father!" Then he embraced Mother tightly, crying, "Mother! Mother!" He sounded like he was weeping. I was shocked at all this. Was this an act? Never in my life had I seen the True Children run in and hug Father and Mother in such a way. They always come in respectfully and bow. I was completely on my guard.

Father asked [Black] Heung Jin Nim to sit on a couch to his right, and he asked Hyo Jin Nim, who was a little bit in back, to go sit beside him. [Black] Heung Jin Nim immediately put his arm around Hyo Jin Nim, grabbed his hand, and said, "My brother, my brother!" in a very close, loving way. I thought, "This is too much!"

I sat down where I could keep my eye on everything. Other leaders sat surrounding the table, and Father began to speak. After a while, neither he nor Mother showed any particular acceptance or non-acceptance of [Black] Heung Jin Nim. They were just natural, as at any leaders' meeting. Some leaders began to ask [Black] Heung Jin Nim questions.

One elder asked, "Many brothers and sisters under me are channeling messages every night from you. How can I tell which ones are really speaking the truth?" [Black] Heung Jin Nim answered: "In the name of True Parents, ask the person who is channeling, 'Do you come from the realm of Shim Jung, the realm of the heart of the True Parents?' If that person can say 'yes' three times, then he is for real. This elder kept on questioning him about it, and finally [Black] Heung Jin Nim got very angry and said, "You are arrogant! You don't understand the providence of restoration!"

At one point, a brother who was translating Father's words hesitated and forgot what Father had just said. [Black] Heung Jin Nim yelled at him very loudly, "You must translate correctly! Correctly! Father's word is absolute! You have to be a total object to Father! Write down word for word everything Father says. Get a pen and paper. Quick! Quick! Hurry up!" That brother had known [Black] Heung Jin Nim since he was a little boy. I thought, "How could he just yell at him that way? Translating from Korean to English is very difficult. If that were really [Black] Heung Jin Nim, he'd be a little more sympathetic."

Hoon Sook Nim watches from the back during the conference.

I Am Not Deceived!

Later on Hoon Sook Nim came in and sat slightly behind him to his left. [Black] Heung Jin Nim turned his head and just glanced at her for a second. I thought, "This is his eternal bride and he doesn't even smile or wink or acknowledge her at all? This proves that it can't be [Black] Heung Jin Nim. Father and Mother seem to really believe this is their son. Well, he may be able to deceive them, but I am not deceived!"

After a while, [Black] Heung Jin Nim went out of the room and then returned, wearing a Korean outfit, and made two full bows in front of True Parents. Then Father asked Mother take him shopping. As they all were leaving, [Black] Heung Jin Nim approached me. I introduced myself, saying, "I am Mr. Kamiyama," and he said, "I know." He asked me how my wife and children were. I said fine, and to sort of check him out I asked him, "Do you know Masao?" Masao was my brother's son, about the same age as [Black] Heung Jin Nim. They had been very good friends when [Black] Heung Jin Nim was on the earth. He said, "Yes." I added, "You know, Masao misses you." He said, "I know, I know." My immediate thought -- again negative -- was, "Anybody could say, 'I know, I know' and still be a fake."

Then just before he got into the car he said to me, "I'm sorry I corrected you so harshly back then, but I had to do it, just to make sure everything is exact." I couldn't understand his heavily accented English, but a security brother who had been writing everything down told me what he said. I thought suspiciously, "It wasn't me he was correcting. Doesn't he even remember who he was talking to?" Such a doubtful spirit was surrounding me. I understood later that [Black] Heung Jin Nim was speaking to me as a representative of all the leaders, referring to the fact that we all needed correcting, because we had such negative minds.

With this heart of intense skepticism, I began the three-day conference in the World Mission Center. Since I know that confession and repentance are good things, I could see value in going, whether this brother was [Black] Heung Jin Nim or Jesus or some other spirit. Through the principle of returning resurrection, I knew that even evil spirits can help you grow by confronting your fallen nature, so no matter what, I could still be cleansed.

My Confession

Just before the conference started, I was invited to a banquet at East Garden along with about 40 other Japanese leaders. During the banquet Father asked me a question. It was about marriage, but I couldn't think of an answer right away. He said, "With that kind of attitude, you might get hit by [Black] Heung Jin Nim'." On this "hopeful" note, I returned to the World Mission Center and went into the conference.

The 40 of us gathered in one room to prepare for our confession. I was standing right in front of [Black] Heung Jin Nim. He asked me, "What did Father say to you about this confession?" I replied, "Well, he said I might get hit by you." He laughed out loud. I admit I had pretty complicated emotions in my mind by then.

We were asked to write down all our sins. I had confidence that I wouldn't be in too much trouble, because I didn't have any record of what I thought was the worst category of sin in the Unification movement -- sexual sins. I thought that any other kind of sin was just trivial and wouldn't really count. I was sure I would get off easy.

One area of sin we were asked to confess was that of disbelief, being disloyal to God and True Parents. This includes Cain/Abel problems and the accompanying resentment. I didn't feel I had any problems in that area. But when it was my turn, and I confessed my sins to [Black] Heung Jin Nim, he shouted out loudly, so that everyone could hear, "Kamiyama's sin is so big!!" The natural reaction in my mind was, "Wait a minute! How can you say that? I don't have any heavy sins." Because of my sin, he said, I had to fast for eight days. I was so shocked! That hit my pride right there in front of all the leaders. I wanted to prove that his judgment was unwarranted, so I took my confession list over to show Rev. Kwak to try and prove I was unjustly treated. People who I knew had seriously sinned had gotten only a three- or four-day fast. What will the leaders and members suspect me of having done, when they find out I have to fast for eight days?! I left the confession room reeling with all kinds of emotions. As I was leaving, [Black] Heung Jin Nim called to the staff, "Tell Mr. Abe to take care of him:"

I felt, "Oh, no. Nov, he's telling other people I need taking care of!"

After our confession we were supposed to pray in repentance, even all night if we could. I wasn't inspired at all to pray. I just kind of leaned against the wall and prayed externally.

On the third day, Rev. Kamiyama tearfully shares his realizations with the brothers and sisters.

A Serious Struggle

The next morning, after the confessions were over, [Black] Heung Jin Nim wanted to speak to us all together. I tried listening for several hours, but I started to become very judgmental about what he was saying. I didn't want to be in the conference anymore, so I went to my office and just sat there. After a while, a brother brought me a message that [Black] Heung Jin Nim wanted me to come back. I said, "Come on, how he could remember my name so easily?" But after getting even more messages from him, I decided to go back into the conference room.

I thought, "Whether this guy is really [Black] Heung Jin Nim or not, he's leading this conference, so I should at least apologize" I said to [Black] Heung Jin Nim, "I'm sorry I wasn't here when you called me." Inside I was ready to really rebel if he returned judgment against me. If he said something harsh to me I would say something even harsher to him. But surprisingly, what he did was just put his arm around me and say very softly and gently, "It's okay, it's okay. Where is your wife? Is she all right?" Somehow he knew that was the best thing he could have done for me at that time.

I stayed in the conference from then on, and every time a doubtful or skeptical thought came into my mind, [Black] Heung Jin Nim would call my name. Toward the end he really shook me out of my doubtful mind by calling out, "Kami!" That's the nickname I got while in Danbury with Father. As I approached him, he picked up a sheet of paper, held it up for me to see, crushed it, and threw it on the floor. I knew what it meant: I have to crush my old concepts and cast them away so I can become new. This demonstration pierced through my doubt more than anything else he had done.

By the third day I was seriously struggling to know if this were [Black] Heung Jin Nim or not, and to understand the meaning of what he was telling me. I prayed, demanding an answer from God, "Please, God, tell me -- is this brother really [Black] Heung Jin Nim? I have to know!" It was a short prayer, but very fervent. Right after that, [Black] Heung Jin Nim began speaking again. A Japanese brother happened to sit near me and start translating for me. For two days I had been struggling without any translator, trying to understand the strong African accent, but now, miraculously, I had this Japanese brother helping me. He said he had lived for three years in the same church center in Africa as the brother who was embodying [Black] Heung Jin Nim. He understood the accent and, from his experience with [Black] Heung Jin Nim at other meetings, he knew the deep content of his teachings. He began translating not only [Black] Heung Jin Nim's words for me, but also his heart. This brother's name was Kamiyoshi, which means "good news from God' I couldn't ask for anything better than that!

Mr. Masatoshi Abe, with his wife, gives his testimony.

My Own Heart Opened

[Black] Heung Jin Nim was speaking about the realm of God's heart, the "realm of Shim Jung He was trying to help us break through the barriers in our hearts and open up to the world of the heart of True Parents. He said, "For us to reach the world of the heart of True Parents, so many of our ancestors were sacrificed. Through the great price of suffering they paid, we have finally reached the point where we are able to taste the true world of the heart. In the realm of True Parents' heart there are no barriers, no categories. Whether a person is black or white or yellow, a man or a woman, a 36 Blessed Couple or a new member, doesn't matter. The heart of True Parents embraces everyone in the same way."

As he was speaking, I realized I had been listening with too critical a mind and comparing [Black] Heung Jin Nim's words with my concept of Father's words. Finally I could accept his message about this amazing realm of the heart of True Parents. My own heart opened, and I could suddenly see in a very different light. [Black] Heung Jin Nim appeared to be shining in a glorious way. I felt as if a veil on my eyes were coming off. I could throw away those stupid, external judgments and begin taking his words into my heart.

What actually happened is beyond description. I was overwhelmed by a feeling of the presence of the Holy Spirit. I just couldn't stop weeping. My wife, next to me, was going through a very similar experience.

Then [Black] Heung Jin Nim began to lead everyone in dancing. I felt from the bottom of my heart that I ought to apologize for my bad attitude of judging everything he had said. I began to speak, and I felt the love of all the 800 other people surrounding me. I didn't have a shred of self-consciousness or concern for my image as a leader. No one was looking at me with those eyes. As my wife and I did a full bow to [Black] Heung Jin Nim, I experienced a flood of tears more overwhelming than I had ever experienced in my life. I was literally weeping with my face and hands on the floor. Then [Black] Heung Jin Nim approached us, lifted us up, and held us close together, comforting us and telling us it was okay, that we were very precious to him.

Everything became new and started coming together. When my eyes were opened, all the reasons for finding any conflict between Father and [Black] Heung Jin Nim melted away.

Why My Sin Was So Big

I realized now why he had said my sin was so big. At the beginning of the conference, his brother Hyo Jin Nim had testified to us in tears that, after his initial skepticism, he accepted [Black] Heung Jin Nim completely the moment he embraced him. But I myself -- in continuing to doubt [Black] Heung Jin Nim and not uniting with True Parents and Hyo Jin Nim in their acceptance of him -- had been completely disloyal to the True Family, committing the sin of rebellion.

Therefore, even though I went into the confession thinking, "I've always followed my Abel loyally," in actuality I was rebelling against the Abel I most needed to unite with at this time, which is Hyo Jin Nim and [Black] Heung Jin Nim united as one.

You see, all these many years I have been close to True Parents, eating with them, meeting with them, receiving direct guidance from them. I had the Messiah. What else did I need? Now I understand that there is an absolute process to follow in order to be restored back to God' Can Cain go to God directly? No. I was looking at [Black] Heung Jin Nim with a total ignorance of this principle.

Up until now, the True Parents have been loving us and taking care of us even though we weren't actually in the position to reach them spiritually. Father and Mother had to deny their own position as parents and come down and raise us up in our state of ignorance, patiently accepting us, forgiving us, and waiting for us to grow. But now the time has come when we must complete our growth by going the exact principled way. It is only when we can make a foundation of substance with our true Abel that we can establish the foundation for the Messiah. That is when we can officially come into the realm of the heart of True Parents.

We have to start from the very bottom, from the servant of servant's position, and go through the position of servant, adopted son, illegitimate son, real son, mother, father, then up to the heart of God. (Illegitimate son means a son who is more distant than a real son.) To follow this course ourselves, we have to raise three spiritual children (illegitimate son position) so that they can be completely united in heart with us. Then we can be blessed and have our own blessed children, who will be in the Abel position. When our spiritual children and our blessed children (real sons) unite, that is the restoration of Cain and Abel, which creates the foundation for the restoration of the parents. Then as restored Adam and Eve, we can come back to the heart of God.

Within the True Family, when Hyo Jin Nim (Cain position) and Heung Jin Nim (Abel position) unite, they come to stand together as the True Abel. As we blessed couples (Cain) achieve unity with the True Abel children, we will be naturally accepted into the world of True Mother and, upon unity with Mother, the world of True Father. Then True Parents can really stand as parents and can take us into the realm of God's heart.

Everyone lines up, in accordance with [Black] Heung Jin Nim's instructions, in preparation for a revitalizing march around the Grand Ballroom.

Not the Same People

I had dinner with [Black] Heung Jin Nim the other day, and he told us how completely united he is with Hyo Jin Nim. [Black] Heung Jin Nim had to return to earth to fulfill the mission he was given.

Hyo Jin Nim has the physical body to take the substantial leadership as the Abel figure. This is the time of their unity. That unity is the key to our movement's now entering into a new level, transcending anything in the past.

Neither [Black] Heung Jin Nim nor Hyo Jin Nim are the same people we used to know. We can't treat them as we used to. Hyo Jin Nim spoke several times at Belvedere about his past and the mistakes he made, but now his past is like dust. Similarly, through confession, you surrender and make an offering of yourself completely, leaving behind your old self and becoming a new "second self." Since [Black] Heung Jin Nim has held these confessions, the unification between the Abel children and the Cain children has substantially begun. As this is fulfilled, we can be guided into the sphere of heart of God and True Parents.

Father has expressed the reality of the world of the heart of God very simply. He says that a person standing in the heart of God is so valued by the universe that he will be completely protected, and everything will want to come to him. Even if that person were dropped off in the jungles of Africa alone, animals or spirit men would be sent to bring food and attend him. After all these years, we finally have the precious opportunity to enter into this world. Some blessed couples may think, "Oh, we can only afford to have two or three children: This limited reasoning has no place in the realm of the heart of True Parents, where nothing is impossible for God's true sons and daughters.

Around the dinner table I expressed to [Black] Heung Jin Nim my concern about helping other Christian ministers accept True Parents. [Black] Heung Jin Nim said to me, "The only thing you should worry about is whether you yourself are firmly rooted in the pure blood lineage of True Parents. If you are, other Christians will automatically come closer to you or they will naturally decline."

If the chosen ones and the second selves can unite centering on the unity of Hyo Jin Nim and [Black] Heung Jin Nim, the Unification Church can become the true Abel to the other Christian churches. Remember, Father taught us that if there is an absolute plus (+), then an absolute minus (-) will appear. If a true Abel exists, Cain can follow easily. When the Unification Church and all of Christianity are unified, the unification of the Fatherland can come about, and then the unification of the free world and the communist world can happen. This will be the foundation to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

How much God and True Parents have been waiting for this chance! This chance has arrived. We must make this unity here today.

Heung Jin Nim's 17th birthday. Left to right: Jin Whi Nim, Hyo Jin Nim, Hyun Jin Nim, Kook Jin Nim, Father, [Black] Heung Jin Nim, Mother, Ye /in Nim, In Jin Nim, Un Jin Nim, and Nan Sook Nim.

True Children's Prayer

Once the Fatherland is established, anyone violating the heavenly standard will be judged severely by the law and will not be permitted to remain there as long as there is sin in him. God can't bear to see that happen to his beloved sons and daughters. So He is sending His ambassadors, his princes -- the True Children -- to offer purification to the blessed couples, allowing us to clean ourselves up so that judgment won't come upon us. This unique opportunity is an amazing blessing. We should be infinitely grateful for this. I found a speech in which Father describes the value of the True Children. To paraphrase:

We, the members of the church, after following True Parents, have committed many mistakes and sins. The only way to be freed from Satan and to have an unshakable foundation to stand in the Kingdom is to be interceded by the True Children of the True Parents. It doesn't matter how long you have been in the Unification Church or how hard you have worked. Receiving the Blessing isn't the qualification. The following words have to come out of the mouth of one of the True Children: "Father and Mother, the members have been working so hard. They may have made many mistakes, yet they loved us as a Cain loves Abel. Because of their enormous love and dedication, please forgive them. Please let them come with us into the Kingdom of Heaven." Only through this intercessory prayer by the True Children can we be released from Satan's accusation and come to stand on an unshakable foundation and enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
[From "Parents, Children, and the World Centered upon Oneself," June 5, 1983.]

The intercession from the true Abel is absolute. Yet some members, after having confessed to [Black] Heung Jin Nim, have been wondering, "Was this for real? Am I really forgiven?" But if we are still doubtful even after our sins have been washed away, this will create a prolongation of the providence of purification.

A Life of Offering

From the Principle we know that original sin can be solved only by True Parents, but the other types of sin we have to solve ourselves. But how do we solve them? For analogy's sake, let's say we carry around so much sin that we deserve to be crushed in a terrible automobile crash. But suppose some person comes along who allows us to pay for that same sin just by pinching us. That is what Heung Jin Nim is able to do for us. Heung Jin Nim is in the very highest position in the spirit world because he himself willingly suffered the crushing blow of Satan so that he could spare us and allow us to go an easier path.

There is no question that indemnity has to be paid by us for the accumulated horrible sins of mankind. There are actually three ways we can pay this indemnity:

1. By uniting in heart completely with the true Abel, who can take that burden of sin on his own shoulders for us.

2. By living a life of offering -- promising to fulfill for God and making every effort to live up to those promises; in this way, we are making ourselves an offering that God can accept.

3. By physical suffering, which is what we have to do if we do not do number 1 or number 2.

Number 1 is the best way, yet the most difficult. It is very hard for fallen man to deny himself completely and absolutely unite with Abel. Number 3 is not something we would voluntarily choose. Therefore, [Black] Heung Jin Nim is teaching us how to live a life of offering -- a lifestyle of obedience and faithful reporting; in short, taking responsibility. Every morning we should make a promise to God and write down what we determine to accomplish that day, then do our utmost to fulfill it. At night we should write down what we actually did accomplish. If we didn't fulfill everything, we must report it and seriously repent to God. If we follow this lifestyle faithfully every day, then we are offering ourselves completely on the altar of God, and God can claim our life. Satan can't touch such a pure offering. If we unite in this way, then we can fulfill the dream of True Parents. The Fatherland will be established, and the world will quickly come back to God.

Do Not Miss This Chance

You know the parable of the five foolish virgins, who, because they carelessly let their lamps go out, were not prepared to meet the bridegroom when he came. At this time, make sure your spiritual eyes and ears are opened. What would happen if you missed this opportunity to confess? If you cannot surrender yourself to your true Abel, you will go through much suffering.

Think about it. If you give yourself into the hand of the true Abel, you may receive some fasting or other condition, but what is that compared to the gift of total freedom? [Black] Heung Jin Nim only wants to make us new and totally erase from our lives the stupid sins we committed in the past. The reason I am testifying to you so frankly, forgetting my pride, is to let you see that I went through it the hard way, but you don't have to. It is not necessary. If some of you are having difficulties in this area, please let me know and I will help you.

The number-one virtue to have in order to receive this heavenly blessing of forgiveness is the meekness of a child. The best advice I can give you is to purify yourself with prayer and fasting to prepare yourself for your confession. I am sure you will have a good experience. Just be an obedient son or daughter of heaven. 

Table of Contents

Tparents Home

Moon Family Page

Unification Library